Jane 07/10/21:  

"Don Juan had already explained to me, in his teachings for the right side, a great deal about the nagual and about seeing. I had understood seeing to be the capacity of human beings to enlarge their perceptual field until they are capable of assessing not only the outer appearances but the essence of everything"

So this has satisfied my curiosity over this ‘seeing’ don calls it. “seeing” is a perception, this explains how I have this microcosmic awareness as well as macrocosmic awareness. I can perceive from an individual, inside a bubble awareness, but I can also perceive from a planetary/humanity whole perspective. Like a satellite orbiting.    

Laz 07/10/21:

Good 🙂

Jane 07/10/21:

"Don Juan explained that in a state of heightened awareness apprentices can behave almost asnaturally as in everyday life, but can bring their minds to focus on anything with uncommon force and clarity" 

So this explains that meditative living? Or maybe diffuse consciousness that I live in going about the day.

Laz 07/10/21:

I’m afraid I don’t know what that is!

Jane 07/10/21:

My brainwaves are in a permanent meditative state again. I have found my own centre of gravity, not the pull from the Matrix. I have no awareness of anything beyond my bubble I don’t even notice my room unless I have to focus on it. I don’t notice things like it getting untidy. I am kind of not in the room, in my full attention. A 5d awareness can live and function quite normally in the world but not off the world.

I have no idea of the coordinates of my mind, but I don’t think it is the 5th I think it is further out than that? 

"When I asked him once what was the essential character of the seers of the new cycle, he said that they are the warriors of total freedom, that they are such masters of awareness, stalking, and intent that they are not caught by death, like the rest of mortal men, but choose the moment and the way of their departure from this world" 

I had read something similar to that in Buddhism. David Hawkins wrote about it too. I actually nearly experienced it and comprehend it as a possibility. 

Laz 07/10/21:

Yes, me too 🙂

Jane 07/10/21:

"We know that nothing can temper the spirit of a warrior as much as the challenge of dealing with impossible people in positions of power. Only under those conditions can warriors acquire the sobriety and serenity to stand the pressure of the unknowable."

So this I could see as something like having the mental capacity to witness and withstand something like the idiocracy. It seriously could drive a person crazy. 

Laz 07/10/21:

Yes, it’s happening in the world now, and still I sleep at night 🙂

Jane 07/10/21:

"The new seers used petty tyrants," don Juan said, staring at me fixedly, 
"not only to get rid of their self-importance, but to accomplish the very sophisticated manoeuvre of moving themselves out of this world. You'll understand that manoeuvre as we keep on discussing the mastery of awareness"

So this reminds me of my perception of the first professional battle I undertook in the Matrix world I fought like a ferocious dog! Lol. Doctors, lawyers and civil servants, even a barrister I took on. When I discovered that I was off planet I complained to my doctor that these people had driven me from my own planet by not playing fair! That was exactly how it felt at the time but not in a victimhood way once I backed off. 

When I consider my exit from the Matrix and how it was accomplished in a western society, I can now recognise it as one heck of a manoeuvre,  but one I did just by going with the flow and following the will of the source.    

Laz 07/10/21:

Yes it is 🙂 As you may have guess I married my petty aggressor, and wouldn’t have it any other way 🙂

Jane 07/10/21:

"Forbearance is something independent. As long as the warrior has control, discipline, and timing, forbearance assures giving whatever is due to whoever deserves it."

This could be seen as the law of karma?     

"The first step is the decision to become apprentices. After the apprentices change their views about themselves and the world they take the second step and become warriors, which is to say, beings capable of the utmost discipline and control over themselves. The third step, after acquiring forbearance and timing, is to become men of knowledge. When men of knowledge learn to see they have taken the fourth step and have become seers" 

So I guess this is the equivalent of attaining an all seeing eye? 

Laz 07/10/21:

Oh, I don’t know! What philosophy has that as it’s goal?

Jane 07/10/21:

"The first truth is that the world is as it looks and yet it isn't," he went on. 
"It's not as solid and real as our perception has been led to believe, but it isn't a mirage either. The world is not an illusion, as it has been said to be; it's real on the one hand, and unreal on the other. Pay close attention to this, for it must be understood, not just accepted. We perceive. This is a hard fact. But what we perceive is not a fact of the same kind, because we learn what to perceive." 

So I guess this is his way of saying we need to grasp concepts like seeing the world as energies, like see and understand the hologram concept whilst recognising that simultaneously with our visual sight we have to see it as solid to make it real. 

Laz 07/10/21:

I don’t think so. I’m not quite sure of your meaning of “real” here. It could be real as in solid, which would be incorrect. If it is real as in the actual truth of something, then yes I would agree.

For me this is about the difference between watching a TV show (I’ve previously used Murder She Wrote as an example) and seeing either an actress in a studio with a flimsy set, or seeing the hypnotic scene as falsely real. Likewise if you look at a car on the street, you can see that it is a ford and it is blue and has four doors, and that you can sit in it and drive it on a road. Or, you can simply see “a thing” in front of you that has no meaning, and only shape.

No thinking about it’s intent. Stopping the world.

Jane 08/10/21:

So when you described your migraine experience where you saw peoples faces blurred with no features and you could not look at them… Would you say there is a similarity or correlation to the stopping the world concept within that experience?  

Laz 08/10/21:

No, I’m afraid that the migraine visual f-ups and Stopping the world are very different.

Jane 08/10/21:

Oh OK thanks for clarifying that 🙂 It just must be a weird experience to have, looking at people with blurred out faces. Sounds like it would be kind of freaky. Lol.  Was it just the faces that were blurred or everything in your vision? 

Laz 08/10/21:

Really just the facial features! 

Stopping the world is like seeing something for the first time and having no words for it, or memories of it, like you have no idea what it is.

Kind of like this:

You can see it has shape and pattern, but have no idea what it is called or what it is for! When you can turn known objects into the unknown and shed your understanding of them, you have stopped the world 🙂

Jane 08/10/21:

That sounds like a level of attention of awareness? My natural state of being when alone. So when my awareness goes around my room, say, I can visually see things that are there but they do not come in the foreground of my mind. They are just there, I don’t even put thought to them in things like … what is that, what is it for, why are they there, do they need to be there, I don’t focus any analysis on anything I am surrounded by.

It is a standing joke that I don’t notice anything unless it is pointed out to me. I guess it is a kind of trance like state of consciousness. As I say my attention is not in my Matrix surroundings, I am not fully grounded in mind into my room at all unless someone walks in, then I have to focus. It is a strange way to be but I am used to it. I think I did stop the world, so I could get off! 😀

Laz 08/10/21:

Yes, with one exception. Where you say it is a kind of trance like state of consciousness, it is actually the opposite, and it is a clearing of the everyday trance, back to a childlike state where everything is new and meaningless 🙂

Jane 08/10/21:

Yes that makes great sense to me. Thank you. Very clarifying:)

It has always been a mystery to me. I can see that it feels trance like from my perspective but is in fact the opposite! So the entrancement of the Matrix world is what others are in, not me? Lol. 

Laz 08/10/21:

Yes, the Matrix is the trance like illusion. 
There is no spoon 🙂

Jane 07/10/21:

We need to recognise different dimensions of seeing/knowing physics, quantum physics and metaphysics. Because with all these subjects they all can be correlated into an interrelated multidimensional comprehension.    

We began to talk about machines and delicate instruments. He said that instruments are extensions of our senses, and I maintained that there are instruments that are not in that category, because they perform functions that we are not physiologically capable of performing.
"Our senses are capable of everything," he asserted.
I think this too that people with the abilities can do machine and delicate instrument jobs, for example I know that by tuning in their own frequencies some minds can act like the lie detectors. 
I said. "Our senses cannot detect radio waves."
"I have a different idea," he said. "I think our senses can detect everything we are surrounded by."
"What about the case of ultrasonic sounds?" I insisted. "We don't have the organic equipment to hear them."
"It is the seers' conviction that we've tapped a very small portion of ourselves," he replied 

I can certainly sense soundwaves, lol. Light can be waves or particles so if you add soundwaves,  I think that is all the hologram is? Frequencies of light and sound. The harmonic spheres of the dimensions? Even chakras correspond to the musical frequency scale.    

Laz 07/10/21:

Yes, light and the absence of light, frequencies and the absence of frequencies 🙂

Jane 07/10/21:

"He went on to say that the new seers, being pragmatically oriented, became immediately cognizant of the compelling power of the emanations. They realized that all living creatures are forced to employ the Eagle's emanations without ever knowing what they are. They also realized that organisms are constructed to grasp a certain range of those emanations and that every species has a definite range. The emanations exert great pressure on organisms, and through that pressure organisms construct their perceivable world" 

So this sounds the same as the dimensional frequency ranges as described for different beings, mineral, plant, animal, etc in the book. The light shall set you free.

Laz 07/10/21:

Yes it does 🙂

Jane 07/10/21:

"This is simply the case of something unknowable vaguely resembling something known," he replied. 
"On account of that, there have certainly been attempts to imbue eagles with attributes they don't have. But that always happens when impressionable people learn to perform acts that require great sobriety. Seers come in all sizes and shapes."
"Do you mean to say that there are different kinds of seers?"
"No. I mean that there are scores of imbeciles who become seers. Seers are human beings full of foibles, or rather, human beings full of foibles are capable of becoming seers" 

So I would class “channelers” as seers but depending on how clear they see determines how much clarity they have in what they channel. 

Laz 07/10/21:

Don’t know, and despite having some experience here, I still consider most channelers to be frauds, sadly. It’s like that meme:

Jane 07/10/21:

"For the old seers," don Juan went on, "to say that the reason for existence is to enhance awareness is not a matter of faith or deduction. They saw it."

They saw that the awareness of sentient beings flies away at the moment of death and floats like a luminous cotton puff right into the Eagle’s beak to be consumed. For the old seers that was the evidence that sentient beings live only to enrich the awareness that is the Eagle’s food.

"I'm a very average man," I said. "The description of an Eagle that devours us had a great impact on me."

So this philosophy was one from the old seers?    

"Genaro is the one who should be here telling you about the Eagle," he said, "except that his versions are too irreverent. He thinks that the seers who called that force the Eagle were either very stupid or were making a grand joke, because eagles not only lay eggs, they also lay turds."
Don Juan laughed and said that he found Genaro's comments so appropriate that he couldn't resist laughter. He added that if the new seers had been the ones to describe the Eagle the description would certainly have been made half in fun 

I just think they had limited consciousness and comprehension. 

"The characteristic of miserable seers is that they are willing to forget the wonder of the world. They become overwhelmed by the fact that they see and believe that it's their genius that counts. A seer must be a paragon in order to override the nearly invincible laxness of our human condition. More important than seeing itself is what seers do with what they see."
"What do you mean by that, don Juan?"
"Look at what some seers have done to us. We are stuck with their vision of an Eagle that rules us and devours us at the moment of our death."
He said that there is a definite laxness in that version, and that personally he did not appreciate the idea of something devouring us

I have not concluded Castaneda’s work yet but I would say it was the old seers prior to don Juan who have misperceived the whole eagle concept as being a malevolent one? … just saying 🙂

Laz 07/10/21:

I don’t know, I’m not sure they offer a new explanation to replace the eagle!

Jane 07/10/21:

Interesting thought i just had…When I consider the different personalities of authors i have read. The worst channelers i would say are narcissists. The best channellers i would say are empaths. I think that maybe explains the difference in quality of work. It’s all about intention and motive. I have read a lot of good information from people who have no interest in fame or being known, just an empathy towards others.

Their work is always far more authentic. I call them source channels. The person who wrote, i.e. channelled “A course in miracles” explained her surprise at being “chosen” for information to come through as she was an atheist, writing about what she saw as Christianity. She was so uncomfortable in being known for this that her extensive work was only released following her death at her specific request. It seems these two opposing character traits seem to play out in every aspect and levels of human life. 

Laz 07/10/21:

That’s probably right, sadly. Those darn narcs are ruining mankind 😀

Jane 11/10/21:

"He admonished me to be impeccable and practice meticulously whatever I learned, and above all, to be careful and deliberate in my actions so as not to exhaust my life force in vain. He said that the prerequisite for entrance into any of the three stages of attention is the possession of life force, because without it warriors cannot have direction and purpose"  

Would you say the life force referred to here, in this context is Kundalini energy? As in working through the different mind realms. 

 

Laz 11/10/21:

There’s definitely crossover, but it’s not a one to one match. 

Jane 11/10/21:

"He had succeeded in surviving to the present day by manipulating his assemblage point, making it move in specific ways to specific locations within his total energy field. Such manoeuvres had permitted his awareness and life force to persist" 

So this resonates with me because by simply being in the Matrix world I honestly felt my vital energy life force being drained from me. I was no longer able to function in that realm, but with no rational understanding of it at the time. I see now how I was making manoeuvres unknowingly.    

"He said that the old seers, being the masters of awareness, applied their expertise to their own glows of awareness and made them expand to inconceivable limits. They actually aimed at lighting up all the emanations inside their cocoons, one band at a time. They succeeded, but oddly enough the accomplishment of lighting up one band at a time was instrumental in their becoming imprisoned in the quagmire of the second attention"

What does lighting up one band at a time mean? 

Laz 11/10/21:

Well this goes back to seeing the luminous egg of man, which I’ve never seen. In theory it is visible light and is in bands around the body. Imagine the battery meter on a phone or tablet, and how as you charge it the little notches grow until the whole thing is lit as fully charged 🙂

Jane 12/10/21:

Yeah, so if you take that luminous egg and battery analogy, aren’t those bands the equivalent of the spheres around chakras within the aura lighting up in sequence, in a similar way? 

Laz 12/10/21:

I don’t think so, they are very different ideas and the luminous bands do not have convergence points like the chakras.

Jane 12/10/21:

Depending on blockages and how much energy there is to raise it? 

Laz 12/10/21:

I think there’s no concept of blockages in the Yaqui philosophy.

Jane 12/10/21:

That image reminds me of your description of that halo moment in your experience 🙂

"The hidden force breaks out of my head and the emanations spread outwards from my skull like a hemisphere of god energy. This is the feeling of a halo like saints of old would have had painted. It is not a two dimensional circle, but we can surely forgive the painters back in the day for not understanding how to paint in the 3rd dimension."

Laz 12/10/21:

Yes, and that lady from Germany wrote about it earlier on twitter, although she placed it in a very elite club, and I was thinking it was a bit much to elevate it to unattainable levels!

Jane 12/10/21:

What German lady? What elite club?

Jane 11/10/21:

"The new seers corrected that error," he continued, "and let the mastery of awareness develop to its natural end, which is to extend the glow of awareness beyond the bounds of the luminous cocoon in one single stroke" 

I don’t understand this? One single stroke, would this be like that major kundalini strike of awareness?    

Laz 11/10/21:

Think of the battery meter on your phone again, and of it being instantly charged without any need to wait 🙂

Jane 11/10/21:

"He did not consider it worthwhile to discuss the random cases of men and other sentient beings who enter into the unknown and the unknowable without being aware of it; he referred to this as the Eagle's gift" 

Could this refer to those who use no self volition to attain anything as a knowable goal? Just doing source’s will?  

Laz 11/10/21:

I don’t know for sure. It’s in the right area of experience, but the Yaqui considered the eagle to be awareness and it feels to me that it is an interactive experience for them, and not a passive one. But clearly in Hindu terms it works. 

Laz 12/10/21:

I would agree that the eagle is awareness and it is an interactive experience for me too even if it is what would be deemed a passive one it is activated by divine intent. So must Source come of itself? Like in each new cycle! I dunno, I’m getting confused now 😀 Anyway, in the matrix level yes I agree…              

Jane 11/10/21:

"He asserted that for the new seers to enter into the third attention is also a gift, but has a different meaning, it is more like a reward for an attainment" 

Maybe it feels more of a reward energy because of the effort, because they are aware of a goal and it’s attainment?    

Laz 11/10/21:

Maybe 🙂

Jane 11/10/21:

"He added that at the moment of dying all human beings enter into the unknowable and some of them do attain the third attention, but altogether too briefly and only to purify the food for the Eagle." 
"The supreme accomplishment of human beings," he said, "is to attain that level of attention while retaining the life-force, without becoming a disembodied awareness moving like a flicker of light up to the Eagle's beak to be devoured."

So does this mean to transcend whilst still incarnate? Is this that move into the second attention?      

Laz 11/10/21:

Hmmm, my closest experience to this was my vision of floating disembodied out in space and seeing the planets and that ladder of stars. Is that transcendence and was the eagle about to devour me before I got sucked back into my body? Don’t know, we’re in the region of pure yoga union/Moksha.

Jane 12/10/21:

I would say this was a transcendence, a separation between physical realm and consciousness and a view of looking from  a cosmic perspective. But no I would not suggest the eagle was about to devour you, but suggest that was a perspective of possibility that your mind had created.

Jane 11/10/21:

"While listening to don Juan's explanation I had again completely lost sight of everything that surrounded me. What I had thought was an hour's conversation had consumed an entire day"

This is exactly like the time warp I experience all the time. When my mind is busy hours fly by 🙂   

"My body shook violently. My arms flew every which way as they shook. I was having something like a seizure. Yet some part of me was detached to the point of becoming fascinated with watching my body vibrate, twist, and shake"

Seizures. I experienced this detached position whilst having seizures. I too was fascinated by observing and even at its most extreme, the fact I was fitting in my bed, did not bother me psychologically at all. This was the point at which I had to come down from the harness position I had been in for years. If I was to explain what energy frequencies caused those seizures it was my environment. Basically soundwaves. They can be like kryptonite to my whole being. I had been in a peaceful meditative like state, for years then instantaneously I was subjected to constant noise. My hearing range that my receivers could pick up had expanded and gone boom! Radar like, my neighbourhood was so loud! I felt like I was living in an acoustic goldfish bowl. Hyperaccusis. I was going from that suspended state to being forcibly grounded. 

I live in the now and that means full on experience in the moment of sensations being felt. A normal mind can distract itself by being busy or just not focusing on background noise where as I cannot. Instead I am in my inactive state and my hearing was amplifying it. There was a nearby factory machine noise going 24/7 that was of a vibration I could not block out even with earplugs, in fact they trapped the sound worse inside my head. I felt like a trapped rat in a cage being Kryptonited. As the vibrations hit my central nervous system it was painful! My consciousness was desperately searching for my natural higher diffused state where I used to just drift in a sea of undifferentiated conscious awareness for many years unable to ground at all, but now my brain was being pierced by horrendous harsh soundwaves including that 24/7 noise/sound in the matrix realms. 

Laz 11/10/21:

I’m sorry to read that, I didn’t realise it was so bad for you 🙁

Jane 11/10/21:

Plus the external sounds were causing extreme rebound tinnitus within, it became a vicious inescapable cycle going on inside my head, like they were in competition. Internal tinnitus versus external noise and after working out the science and physics of my ridiculous situation, I longed to push my head into a vacuum where sound has no medium to travel through. This being the only way I could rationalise a solution in my desperation as a way to make it all stop! By my own experiences I came to really understand the stress that can be put on creatures from environment and human activity, e.g. Why captive kept birds feathers can fall out or caged animals can lose fur or simply die due to stress.

I know for an absolute fact that I would not have been able to survive remaining under those matrix circumstances. I needed some peace and quiet! It was like being tortured, and it went on for more than 6 months without a second of respite so I state that fact with no exaggeration. I had gone from a peaceful meditative being to a manic wreck and I could not hide my distress. I know it really upset my daughter to witness what I was going through. My reactions and behaviour was out of my control at times I was just like a scuttling animal around the perimeters of our property searching for an escape from the sound range.

Laz 11/10/21:

This reminds me of those people who are electromagnetically sensitive 🙁

Jane 11/10/21:

My behaviour looked crazy so I kept having to reassure my family that this would all stop and I would be fine once we moved home and that I would not let it drive me insane. I felt like I was being broken down physically and mentally I could not function, my skin and scalp broke out with severe eczema from the stress my meatbag was under, I started to tremor and finally I started to have fits/seizures. The concept of kryptonite on superman made perfect sense to me.

I even had a moth to the flame experience, I was ready to go! I was getting absolutely no sleep and no peace unable to escape the stimulations. I did not have insomnia because I could not sleep but because I was being kept awake and prevented from sleeping due to the noise! That others either could not hear at all as it was too far away or heard so faintly it was not an issue, yet it was painfully and mind twistingly in my head torturing me. You begin to look like a crazy person or like you are just hearing things. But as they saw the drastic affect it was having on me they did understand my urgent need and got me out of their as quickly as was feasibly possible 🙂

Subsequently I was put on the drug zopiclone to knock me out at night and was surprised to read in the leaflet that the withdrawals from coming off the drug were the same as the reasons I was having to take it? 

Zopiclone - "Sudden withdrawal of treatment will lead to extreme anxiety, tension, restlessness and in severe cases other effects may appear, such as hypersensitivity to light, noise and physical contact, abnormally acute hearing and painful sensitivity to sound, derealisation ( feeling the world around you is not real), depersonalisation ( feeling your mind is becoming separated from your body) or epileptic seizures (violent fitting or shaking)"

As the drug is a hypnotic, and I was experiencing the symptoms of a come down from this drug before taking the drug, this kind of indicated to me and gave a clue that my symptoms sounded like they were from the forced grounding of my conscious awareness by the disturbance of soundwaves from what must have been something like being in a previously hypnotic like state? 

It felt like being dragged back into hell as my brainwaves sped up in order to communicate and interact again. As well as learn technology, my first contact being that website when I emailed the owner. The sensory problems to some degree still persist although much improved but I still feel I am at the mercy of my environment. I just do not feel like I resonate with the vibrations of this planet, like an alien in every way. 👽 🙂

Laz 11/10/21:

On this point I’m there with you 🙁

Jane 11/10/21:

So can I conclude it was due to being forced from the second attention? Back down into the first? Dropping from the “suspended cocoon from the ceiling, of healing”.?  Lol. Or was this from the third? Because the manoeuvre I made back into that matrix felt like one hell of a drop. I told you it turned out to be a march into hell, but I know for a heavenly cause :).

Laz 11/10/21:

I’m not sure, sorry. The Castaneda books to the best of my memory don’t describe symptoms like yours 🙁 It’s probably quite difficult to superimpose Christianity over Yaqui beliefs, but I’ve had that Christian experience too, thankfully why I’m so chilled about everything going on in the world now! I have this mentality of “I faced that, so I can easily face this”

Jane 11/10/21:

"The first attention works very well with the unknown. It blocks it; it denies it so fiercely that in the end, the unknown doesn't exist for the first attention" 

So this is the purely tonal level of attention in awareness?   

Laz 11/10/21:

I thought the eagle was awareness, I’m getting confused now.

Jane 11/10/21:

"He said that the second attention is also called the left-side awareness; and it is the vastest field that one can imagine, so vast in fact that it seems limitless"
"I wouldn't stray into it for anything in this world," he went on. "It is a quagmire so complex and bizarre that sober seers go into it only under the strictest conditions."
"The great difficulty is that the entrance into the second attention is utterly easy and its lurenearly irresistible."

So this again, is that nagual realm we can get trapped in? 

Laz 11/10/21:

Yes, and I think I did for a while during Christmas of 2013.

Jane 11/10/21:

"The third attention is attained when the glow of awareness turns into the fire from within: aglow that kindles not one band at a time but all the Eagle's emanations inside man's cocoon." 
Don Juan expressed his awe for the new seers' deliberate effort to attain the third attention while they are alive and conscious of their individuality

So can you explain a bit better the third attention please? 

Laz 11/10/21:

I’m not sure I understand it myself. I have experienced the firing of all my neurons at once causing like an EMP in my skull, following that moment I felt a new awareness for a time, that might be it!

Jane 12/10/21:

Yes I would say so

Jane 11/10/21:

"Human beings take notice of the emanations they have inside their cocoons," he replied. 
No other creatures do that. The moment the pressure from the emanations at large fixates the emanations inside, the first attention begins to watch itself. It notes everything about itself, or at least it tries to, in whatever aberrant ways it can. This is the process seers call taking an inventory.
"I don't mean to say that human beings choose to take an inventory, or that they can refuse to take it. To take an inventory is the Eagle's command. What is subject to volition, however, is the manner in which the command is obeyed."

So the observer, and the life reviewer? The difference between being called and (self) chosen?    

Laz 111/10/21:

Same person, right? It’s the overthinking thing I do, where I question every thought and it’s origin and meaning, and all of those words spoken by people around me. This I think does have an equivalent in Yoga called Dhyana.

Jane 12/10/21:

I thought that was a mental health problem I had. Lmao. Strange how these yogas are seen as mental health issues in the west?    

Jane 11/10/21:

"Observing all this, seers arrived at a practical conclusion. They saw that men of reason are bound to live longer, because by disregarding the impulse of the emanations at large, they quiet down the natural agitation inside their cocoons. The self-absorbed individuals, on the other hand, by using the impulse of the emanations at large to create more agitation, shorten their lives"

I understand this as the balance of the mind from turmoil and for me the physical law of economy of energy….  lol. That’s me 🙂    

Don Juan said that the old seers observed that the wetness of water only dampens or soaks, but that the fluidity of water moves. It runs, they surmised, in search of other levels underneath us. They believed that water had been given to us not only for life, but also as a link, a road to the other levels below.

"In this respect those old seers were not mistaken," he went on.
"They hit the nail right on the head. Entities that the new seers call allies do appear around water holes."

So this water thing, I have said that my friend had a thing about it affecting his consciousness in some way, do you recognise anything from what is said here? Can you also give more detail of what it does? Do you mean it brings clarity? 

Laz 11/10/21:

For me water is a conduit, it lubricates the flow of revelation from “out there” to “in me” I find that the veil is thinner when I am submersed in the bath. I find that it does bring me clarity and calms my thinking. I tend to go have a bath when I need some advice from Tess (T6yr4), and/or to understand something that is going on in the world. Water for me is spiritual oil!

Jane 12/10/21:

That is quite fascinating to me because it is something I have not myself experienced so I had no real understanding of it. I am just curious, could it be to do with the fact that as a meatbag we hold a high volume of water? 

Ok googled it…..

"An average adult body is 50 to 65 percent water -- that's roughly 45 quarts. Men are more watery than women. A man's body is 60 to 65 percent water, compared to 50 to 60 percent for a woman. In infants, the figure is a whopping 70 percent"

Laz 12/10/21:

I’m not sure, it may be to do with transmissions that can’t make it through the air get through water, kinda like whalesong being heard miles away!

Jane 12/10/21:

Could that be another experience that is different on a meatbag level between male and female? :DOr am i just overthinking. Lol. 

Laz 12/10/21:

Sure, although I have a bunch of stereotypes now popping into my mind about each sex and their use of the bathroom 🙂

Jane 12/10/21:

I know that water is a conductor of electricity,  maybe that is a relevance? 

Laz 12/10/21:

Yes, a similar thing for spirit 🙂

Jane 11/10/21:

"But did they actually descend bodily?" I asked.
"You'd be surprised what men are capable of, especially if they control awareness," he replied.
"The old seers were aberrant. In their excursions to the depths they found marvels. It was routine for them to encounter allies.
"Of course, by now you realize that to say the depths is a figure of speech. There are no depths, there is only the handling of awareness. Yet the old seers never made that realization."

I think there are many things that the old seers did not realise due to their perceptions and limitations of the times. To me most things like shamanic work is a figure of speech, supposed to be symbolic. Their excursions would give them a mental construct of that symbology that would be interpreted by their own psyche. Also probably depending on what plant substances they used. 

"At least, there is nothing that seers can do. Seers aim to be free, to be unbiased witnesses incapable of passing judgment; otherwise they would have to assume the responsibility for bringing about a more adjusted cycle. No one can do that. The new cycle, if it is to come, must come of itself." 

So these old seers were not unbiased and as such were unable to assume responsibility for bringing in a more adjusted cycle.

Laz 12/10/21:

feels right 🙂

Laz 11/10/21:

I feel this is true of our current worldly situation. This totalitarianism must be allowed to come, and then it shall be dealt with, but it must arrive so that a new cycle can begin and we must see the effects.

Jane 12/10/21:

But I am sorry……   I was thinking on a spiritual level I read this symbolically. Spiritually a new cycle must come of itself to me means has to come from the spiritual realm of source itself. Evolution via source channelers.  

Laz 12/10/21:

Yes, this is like that age of Aquarius from astrology. A new cycle coming from source, with new challenges!

Laz 11/10/21:

I feel this means me being carted off to an an internment camp too, sadly 🙁

Jane 12/10/21:

I really think that you have gone a bit too far here  🙂 I am curious as to why do you even feel that way? Because no one is going to do anything to you like that 🙂 

Laz 12/10/21:

Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you the wonderful country formerly known as Australia: https://summit.news/2021/10/12/australia-building-quarantine-camps-for-ongoing-operations/

Jane 11/10/21:

"And what happened to your promise to God?"

My benefactor said not to worry, that it had been a good promise, but that I didn’t know yet that there is no one to hear such promises, because there is no God. All there is is the Eagle’s emanations, and there is no way to make promises to them.

Again I see this as the individual perceptions of the old seers. As well as their use of the term “god” I mean they were way off from being godlike beings. Lol. How could they know or have had clear seeing? 

Laz 11/10/21:

This was Carlos trying to impose Christianity on the Yaqui mind, the two do not fit well together! 

Jane 11/10/21:

"Those old seers were terrifying men," don Juan continued. 
"I shouldn't use the past tense - they are terrifying even today. Their bid is to dominate, to master everybody and everything."

This intent and motive does not come from Source. Rather I see it as the psychospiritual black sorcery shit of cultural programming of these practitioners and that was then used to manipulate the ignorant and innocent that still goes on today in some native cultures.  lol. 

Laz 11/10/21:

Love this 🙂 Yeah, like the native Britons!

Jane 11/10/21:

From pdf on “kundalini psychosis or transcendence”  you sent to me. 

CROSS‐CULTURAL ASPECTS OF KUNDALINI In Africa 
"Katz (1973) writes of the !Kung people of the Kalahari Desert in Northwest Botswana, Africa,who dance for many hours to "heat" up the n/um so that the !kia state can be attained. Henotes that n/um is analogous to the kundalini state. !Kia is the state of transcendence. It is more than a peak experience of going beyond the ordinary self; !kia is like Satori, participation in eternity. Education for transcendence teaches the adept the way to stir up the n/um and how the threshold of fear can be crossed into the !kia state. The n/um is said to reside in the pit of the stomach. As it warms up, it rises from the base of the spine to the skull where then !kia occurs"

So maybe these old seers did not have a full Kundalini activation episode? Or the right education? I would say in our cases it was spontaneous as we did not have the education at that time or knowledge on how to raise it.     

Laz 11/10/21:

Or it was activated through Ida or Pingala, and not Sushumna! Like the Jedi and the Sith, Sushumna and Ida/Pingala Kundalini practitioners could be mirrors of each other.

Jane 12/10/21:

I need some clarification on this I am not understanding your terminology. Do you mean that the Ida and Pingala transports the basic life force in all beings and the Sushuma is what activates only in a kundalini activated being? Like powers up the system. Lol. 

Laz 12/10/21:

Funnily enough this is Yoga.

Jane 12/10/21:

Do you mean the need for clarification is a kind of yoga ?

Laz 12/10/21:

There are 6 Nadis (hosepipes) that converge at the chakras and in theory snake the length of your body. When Kundalini (water) rises through the central 4 Nadis (pipes) it is a pure and positive experience. However kundalini rising through either of the other Nadis leads to a negative experience, with it’s mental health issues anxiety and dark visions. I’m not sure why they are divided this way, but have attached images of them to help explain.

Jane 12/10/21:

What do you mean by the practitioners being mirrors? I don’t really get the Jedi Sith thing. Because I’ve not seen the films. Lol. 

Laz 12/10/21:

So like there are good Jedi, and bad Sith each using the force. There are good Kundalini Yoga practitioners raising Kundalini shakti through Sushumna, and bad ones raising it through Ida or Pingala.

Jane 12/10/21:

What I find interesting is that the level of what is termed Christ consciousness level was achieved from very different paths, your teachings and philosophies are very different to mine yet it achieved the same outcome goal. Many paths to the same thing. 

Laz 12/10/21:

This is as it should be “all roads lead to Rome” 😀

Jane 12/10/21:

What also interests me is that you have often named specific yoga, e.g.   “This i think does equivalent in Yoga called Dhyana”   “we’re in the region of pure yoga union/mocksha” 

I had no idea what they mean, lol. But I have obviously been doing them so obviously you don’t need to know what it is called when you are just doing stuff naturally.   

Laz 11/10/21:

Yes my case was spontaneous, although my spirit had been prepared for it throughout my life, unknowingly to me! 

Jane 11/10/21:

"Transcending himself, a master is able to contact the super‐natural realm and combat the ghosts that cause illness. The struggle with the ghosts is at the heart of the n/um master's art, skill, and power. Just as at the moment of transcendence fear of dying is overcome so that rebirth may occur, so at the moment of healing the battle with sickness is won. The sole criterion for determining who becomes a n/um master is the process itself. Every person who experiences n/um and is able to !kia is automatically a n/um master"

I dont think some old seers succeeded in battling their demons. Remember they had native superstitious mind sets about everything they perceived.

Laz 11/10/21:

I agree, and they might have liked it that way 🙁

Jane 11/10/21:

It is seen as being all symbolic to the more rational modern mind of seers or those who do not use mind altering plants.    

"Katz points out that the !Kung seek !kia not only for their own personal enrichment, but to help others. Nor is it cultivated as a long term condition. A tribe member must soon return to an ordinary state and the usual responsibilities. An extended !kia is not seen as a state ofgrace but as a mistake. !kia is for entering the religious dimension, receiving its nourishment, sharing it in healing, and then to return and live this truth with one's fellows"

So put into context of their primitive natures these were the standards for Kundalini masters in experiences in Africa in this pdf document. This is why I conclude that the perceptions of the old seers would be limited or even malevolent in nature. Being of a lower level, if they were not themselves enlightened.

Thinking about it, this makes sense to me now, by comparing the old and new seers in a timeline, I guess it is no different to comparing the old testament to the new? That went from an angry, jealous, vengeful god of the old testament, eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth mindset to bringing in a loving, forgiving turn the other cheek

Laz 11/10/21:

Yes, sort of!

Jane 12/10/21:

I am thinking that what I perceive, understand and term a “multidimensional conscious awareness” is the equivalent of a “multi attention awareness” as defined,  I would say I have all three. I am now thinking that actually my awareness level changes like a chameleon. Adapts as required.  

Laz 12/10/21:

I struggle with some of Castanedas explanations, and the third attention is a bit like the duality conundrum for me, I find Hinduism and Yoga much more practical. I’m pleased however that it makes sense to you and you can relate to the Yaqui.

Jane 15/10/21:

"This process of emphasizing certain emanations," don Juan went on, "was discovered and practiced by the old seers. They realized that a nagual man or a nagual woman, by the fact that they have extra strength, can push the emphasis away from the usual emanations and make it shift to neighboring ones. That push is known as the nagual's blow."

Is this referring to nagual blow or shift as in their physical strike method of a shock,  sudden force for switching states of awareness? Or can the blow be non physical? Like a mind shift. 

Laz 15/10/21:

I’ll have to check but I thought this was more like hitting someone to change of outcomes of events by altering the structure of the filaments of the universe through the assemblage point.

Jane 15/10/21:

For me that shift is automatic now, the different levels of the first, second and third attentions are fluid for me and seem to be automatic. I dont even notice it. I don’t shift so much as drift. Lol.  

"Don Juan said that the shift was utilized by the old seers in practical ways to keep their apprentices in bondage. With that blow they made their apprentices enter into a state of heightened, keenest, most impressionable awareness; while they were helplessly pliable, the old seers taught them aberrant techniques that made the apprentices into sinister men, just like their teachers" 

Yeah, typical black sorcery 🙁   

“The new seers employ the same technique, but instead of using it for sordid purposes, they used it to guide their apprentices to learn about man’s possibilities”  

white sorcery 🙂   

"Don Juan explained that in order for our first attention to bring into focus the world that we perceive, it has to emphasize certain emanations selected from the narrow band of emanations where man's awareness is located. The discarded emanations are still within our reach but remain dormant, unknown to us for the duration of our lives"  
"the assemblage point that selects internal and external emanations for alignment. The particular alignment that we perceive as the world is the product of the specific spot where our assemblage point is located on our cocoon."

Emanations must be like the energy frequencies, like a basic 3d mind has a narrow bandwidth that it can access like an old radio receiver. Much like a blinker on a horse but of the mind as well as eyes.

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes

Jane 15/10/21:

An awakened mind has the potential to expand the blinkered view in order to be a receiver of a much wider spectrum and see a bigger picture. A modern day digital radio receiver. Or even remove the blinkers altogether. Become a detached satellite receiver. 

I now understand dimensions and attentions as the same thing 🙂 

he continued, "that dealing with petty tyrants helps seers accomplish a sophisticated maneuver: that maneuver is to move their assemblage points."

So I would say that my “tyrants” were strangers to me. Professionals I dealt with. It is interesting to me that you married yours. Lol. Oh actually thinking about it, maybe I did too? Lmao. 

Laz 15/10/21:

Yeah, Ali makes me a better person 🙂 I am not surprised that the same is true for you.

Jane 15/10/21:

I would say my more intimate petty tyrant was my husband and dealing with his moods from PTSD from his military service. He was not always easy to deal with, at times it was like a walking on eggshells feeling at anything you say. He did have a short fuse at times.

Then during my transformation, spiritually we went from being alike as both atheists to opposites….When I expressed that I thought I was no longer an atheist, I was informed..

“If you become a born again Christian we will end up divorced”

but I just laughed, somewhat shocked by the thought of me becoming born again myself. I never pushed my beliefs onto anyone and thought it will become self evident if you have the eyes to notice. It may even rub off like osmosis rather than me expressing by preaching. And sure enough he has changed a lot, in many ways and I no longer felt I was walking on eggshells. Rather than see it as a cause for divorce I used it as an indicator of my own abilities and started to actually gauge my own individual progress by it.

Is that the idea of the petty tyrant? How do you view it?   

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes, exactly as i would describe it. However, as above and as Carlos wrote the upside is that it makes you better. It kinda feels bad to be using someone for this purpose I suppose, but I am not causing Ali any harm by bettering myself.

Jane 15/10/21:

and that fear did not exist as soon as the glow of awareness moved beyond a certain threshold inside man's cocoon  
It meant that I had moved my assemblage point away from its customary position. In other words, my glow of awareness had moved beyond a certain threshold, also erasing my fear. And all this had happened because I had enough surplus energy"

Yes, from a detached position and from the illusion perspective you can see there is nothing to fear but the illusion of fear itself. The main drainer of the human life force energy. Sure it is a required temporary adrenaline fuelled reaction for survival in extreme circumstances but does not need to be a constant state.    

"Are there different types of dents?" I asked.
"There are only two types," he responded. 
"One is a concavity and the other is a crevice; each has a distinct effect. The concavity is a temporary feature and produces a temporary shift - but the crevice is a profound and permanent feature of the cocoon and produces a permanent shift."

This to me explains the difference between a temporary shift in conscious awareness, for example whilst using a high on drugs where you have to come down again, and the minds capacity to retain the shift as a natural state.

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes, although I think maybe we need that temporary shift to know that it is possible and for me at least to recognise it as something familiar, then later one can get there without help and remain there long term. It’s like catching the glimpse of something in your peripheral vision, and thinking that was weird, then turning to look directly at it and focus on it to get a good look 🙂

Jan 15/10/21:

"Those visions are the product of man's inventory," he went on. 
"They are of no value for warriors in search of total freedom, because they are produced by a lateral shift of the assemblage point."
He stopped talking and looked at me. I knew that by "lateral shift" he had meant a shift of the point from one side to the other along the width of man's band of emanations instead of a shift in depth. I asked him if I was right.
"That's exactly what I meant," he said. "On both edges of man's band of emanations there is a strange storage of refuse, an incalculable pile of human junk. It's a very morbid, sinister storehouse. It had great value for the old seers but not for us" 

I think this explains my shift from one side to the other of a kind of pendulum swing of both polarities in the dual realm, far right to far left in views and perceptions but I also went into depth to calculate what don calls the pile of human junk. Understand the psychology of it all.   

"Don Juan restated, as if on second thought, that one of the most mysterious aspects of the seers' knowledge is the incredible effects of inner silence. He said that once inner silence is attained, the bonds that tie the assemblage point to the particular spot where it is placed begin to break and the assemblage point is free to move"

Yes, there is something about silence and stillness that has a profound effect. Only that way could I move the assemblage point vertically. 🚀lol.     

Laz 15/10/21:

Here is your cross over to Yoga and meditation, and the new knowledge and experience that follows silencing the chattering mind. To the MOON!

Jan 15/10/21:

Don Juan also said that among the many errors of judgment the old seers had committed, one of the most grievous was moving their assemblage points to the immeasurable area below, which made them experts at adopting animal forms. They chose different animals as their point of reference and called those animals their nagual. They believed that by moving their assemblage points to specific spots they would acquire the characteristics of the animal of their choice, its strength or wisdom or cunning or agility or ferocity

Power animals in native shamanics. The area of lower levels where shamanism seemed to take them. I also went through that stage but just in my learning where the different animals for me represented just human mind traits, qualities and capabilities.    

Laz 15/10/21:

Out of curiosity, what were your animals?

Jane 15/10/21:

I don’t remember now, my first book on shamanism was explaining the characteristics of different power animals and I was in a full on battle with everyone, medical, legal and political. When I read the abilities that a belief in these animals gave a human I realised I was utilising them all. Things like courage, putting up a good fight or seeing a situation clearly. In my early learning I found that I would read information, sleep on it, and it would process in my sleep. It was really cool 🙂

I am sure it still happens today. I often wake up with information processing going through my mind but I can never hold onto it to remember what it is about once awake.    

Jane 15/10/21:

He also said that women seers have an extraordinary capacity to make their assemblage points hold on to any position in the area below. Men cannot. Men have sobriety and purpose, but very little talent; that is the reason why a nagual must have eight women seers in his party. Women give the impulse to cross the immeasurable vastness of the unknown. Together with that natural capacity, or as a consequence of it, women have a most fierce intensity. They can, therefore, reproduce an animal form with flare, ease, and a matchless ferocity

I am not convinced that men and woman differ in such ways as they perceived? It sounds more like stereotyping to me ? 

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes I would agree, but think while it is not accurate to the awakened, it is true of the asleep, sadly. Women have a very innate ability to put men in their place with a power that comes from somewhere deep down. There’s an emotion and a tone, and a severity, that women posses and men do not, you know that image of a mother telling of their child. For me this was always so much worse than my father telling me off.

Jane 15/10/21:

That’s interesting because it was the opposite for me 🙂   

Jane 15/10/21:

"If you think about scary things," he continued, "about something unnamable lurking in the darkness, you're thinking, without knowing it, about a woman seer holding a position in the immeasurable area below. True horror lies right there. If you ever find an aberrant woman seer, run for the hills!" 

lmao. I think they were just afraid of feminine energy. Lol.   

Laz 15/10/21:

Perhaps correctly 🙂

Jane 15/10/21:

He explained that the assemblage point not only effects the alignment needed for perception, but also obliterates the alignment of certain emanations in order to arrive at a greater refinement of perception, a skimming, a tricky human construct with no parallel

Is this not the act of filtering out the irrelevant, what the mind ignores? 

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes, I think so, and it includes the paranormal not just thoughts and emotions and human stuff.

Jane 15/10/21:

An example of higher mind skimming is filtering out the bullshit. Or a one point focus. But a good example for lower mind skimming being that of selective hearing.    

I had a sense of physical weariness. I felt languid, indifferent, and yet I experienced a sense of spiritual strength. I realized then that I had lost something. There was no strength in my body. I could hardly stand. My legs finally gave in and I sat down and then I lay down on my side. WhileI lay there, I had the most wonderful, fulfilling thoughts of love for God, for goodness

Maybe it was in losing my physical strength/energy in the matrix that gave me that inner spiritual strength?    

Laz 15/10/21:

Could it have been a sign that you had to change and the universe willed it?

Jane 15/10/21:

Absolutely! I crashed for a reason.    

Jane 15/10/21:

“The skimmings of men,” don Juan continued, “are more real than what other creatures perceive. That is our pitfall. They are so real to us that we forget we have constructed them by commanding our assemblage points to appear where they do. We forget they are real to us only because it is our command to perceive them as real” 

So is this the illusion or maya? 

Our perception of life is what we focus on. We have the power to skim the top off the alignments, but we don't have the power to protect ourselves from our own commands. That has to be learned. To give our skimmings a free hand, as we do, is an error of judgment for which we pay as dearly as the old seers paid for theirs.

The ego self and subconscious is where most peoples commands come from, with no real free will to power to command.  We can be our own worst enemies. 

"The fact of the matter is that many children see," he went on. "Most of those who see are considered to be oddballs and every effort is made to correct them, to make them solidify the position of their assemblage points."

The egoless child that is still connected to source? 

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes, but I think the aberration is not that the child was connected to source, the aberration is that we severed that chord, and grew up without it. We replaced it with our own sense of self worth and power.

Jane 15/10/21:

"But would it be possible to encourage children to keep their assemblage points more fluid?" I asked.    
"Only if they live among the new seers," he said. "Otherwise they would get entrapped, as the old seers did, in the intricacies of the silent side of man. And, believe me, that's worse than being caught in the clutches of rationality."

The star children come to mind here 🙂 If they were identifiable and had properly educated parents they would do much better. Then maybe they could learn to have and control a more fluid attention? happier existence for those who feel different.    

"What are we really doing, don Juan?" I asked. "Is it possible that warriors are only preparing themselves for death?
"No way," he said, gently patting my shoulder. 
"Warriors prepare themselves to be aware, and full awareness comes to them only when there is no more self-importance left in them. Only when they are nothing do they become everything."

I have had that moment in consciousness of becoming nothing yet paradoxically it felt like everything. I think you said you did too?    

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes, more than once. It is at that point where you surrender to the will of the universe and decide that you will only do it’s bidding that you become paradoxically free. The ego can never surrender and thus people with big ego’s that control all those around them who are the most slave like, sadly 🙁 It’s the test which we have spoken about, the choosing of a side, becoming a Jedi Master or a Sith Lord. 

Jane 15/10/21:

"In order to be unbiased witnesses," he went on, "we begin by understanding that the fixation or the movement of the assemblage point is all there is to us and the world we witness, what ever that world might be" 

The illusional world of assumptions and misperceptions?  

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes

Jane 15/10/21:

"Women are definitely more bizarre than men," don Juan finally said. "The fact that they have an extra opening between their legs makes them fall prey to strange influences. Strange, powerful forces possess them through that opening. That's the only way I can understand their quirks."

I have noticed throughout that they do seem to be somewhat obsessed with vaginas? Lol. Maybe considering they were meant to be warriors it is subconscious because they can come across at times like real pussies themselves! Lmao. Joke.  

Laz 15/10/21:

As many cultures have been, the chalice and the blade for example are Christian obsessions! Many cultures also have been dominated by strong men, and women have been subjugated on the base of strength. I’d love to see what a truly balanced modern culture would look like with for example both the joint female and male leaders sharing traits of the other 🙂

Jane 15/10/21:

"That's why I've said that women are more bizarre than men," he commented at last.      
"I don't agree with you," Genaro said to don Juan. "The nagual Julian didn't have an extra hole between his legs and he was more weird than la Catalina" 

Lmao. It just gets funnier….

"I found myself making love," Genaro continued, and he winked at me. "Usually I was afraid to death of women. But one day I found myself in bed with a most ferocious woman, it was so unlike me that when I realized what I was doing I nearly had a heart attack"

….and funnier. 🤣😂I would suggest that was not an act of making love but lust. And on both parts with Genaro attracting it, and that type of woman to himself.  Lol.    

"warriors are in the world to train themselves to be unbiased witnesses, so as to understand the mystery of ourselves and relish the exultation of finding what we really are. This is the highest of the new seers' goals. And not every warrior attains it"

I think this stands for everything that only the unconditionally unbiased witness can possibly be in any position to perceive the truth.    

"He said that by now he had explained most of the truths about awareness, and that there was only one truth left to discuss. The last truth, he assured me, was the best of the old seers' findings, although they never knew that themselves. Its tremendous value was only recognized, ages later, by the new seers."
"I've explained to you that man has an assemblage point," he went on, "and that that assemblage point aligns emanations for perception. We've also discussed that that point moves from its fixed position. Now, the last truth is that once that assemblage point moves beyond a certain limit, it can assemble worlds entirely different from the world we know."

Does this mean like create your own reality? Perceptions, as in create your own world? I would certainly say that most of my time I live in my own world 🙂    

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes, this goes back to what I was thinking earlier and altering the structure of the filaments of the universe. it is that way of changing the outcome of events such that they should not happen, yet they do. I’m reminded of my 2013 experience with my wife and her mother desperate to get a doctor out to see me and them phoning back hours later to say no one could come. For them it was angering. For me, it was joyous and I think I made that change myself by following the instructions given to me by the source.

Or like today in the news, there is a scandal that the expected number of covid cases is not rising in line with expectations, due to a company apparently not running the PCR tests correctly: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-58922518 I’m fairly sure this is source’s will and has been brought about through the actions of good fighting evil. I laughed so hard when I read it this morning, those bastards wanted a spike in cases to bring in vaccine passports, and they didn’t get it. Everyone I know has been ill, but it apparently it isn’t covid 😀

They’re fucking livid at the top! 

Jane 15/10/21:

He further said that to be a peerless nagual, one has to love freedom, and one has to have supreme detachment. He explained that what makes the warrior's path so very dangerous is that it is the opposite of the life situation of modern man. He said that modern man has left the realm of the unknown and the mysterious, and has settled down in the realm of the functional. He has turned his back to the world of the foreboding and the exulting and has welcomed the world of boredom

I get the supreme detachment of a nagual but when he says a peerless nagual does he mean one with no companion? 

Laz 15/10/21:

Yes, i’d say so. Maybe like you and me sitting at home on our todds 🙂

Jane 15/10/21:

One thing I found most interesting was when I discovered that I was no longer subject to boredom. I don’t ever get bored. It is no longer in my repertoire of experiences.    

Laz 15/10/21:

No, me either, and I don’t understand how others do! The world is overflowing with interesting stuff to learn and do.

Jane 15/10/21:

I asked don Juan if la Catalina's knowledge was inherently different from his own.
"We are exactly the same," he replied. "She's more like Silvio Manuel or Genaro; she is really the female version of them, but, of course, being a woman she's infinitely more aggressive and dangerous than both of them."
Genaro assented with a nod of his head. "Infinitely more," he said and winked again" 

I think this perception of women is funny, but there again maybe they are correct with the old type of  women seers? Or the particular ones they encountered. Lol. Roflmao, this was like a comedy sketch to my sense of humour. 🤣😂……     

"The nagual Julian kept me once for two days in this warrior's position," Genaro whispered to me. "I even had to urinate while I sat in this position."
"And defecate," don Juan added.
"Right," Genaro said. And then he whispered to me, as if on second thought, "I hope you did your kaka earlier. If your bowels aren't empty when la Catalina shows up, you'll shit in your pants, unless I show you how to take them off. If you have to shit in this position, you've got to get your pants off." 
He began to show me how to maneuver out of my trousers. He did it in a most serious and concerned manner. All my concentration was focused on his movements. It was only when I had gotten out of my pants that I became aware that don Juan was roaring with laughter. I realized that Genaro was again poking fun at me. I was about to stand up to put on my pants, when don Juan stopped me. He was laughing so hard that he could hardly articulate his words. He told me to stay put, that Genaro did things only half in fun, and that la Catalina was really there behind the bushes. 
His tone of urgency, in the midst of laughter, got to me. I froze on the spot. A moment later a rustle in the bushes sent me into such a panic that I forgot about my pants. I looked at Genaro. He was again wearing his pants. He shrugged his shoulders.
"I'm sorry," he whispered. "I didn't have time to show you how to put them back on without getting up."

That is so funny. It is perfectly understandable that this era of seers was limited, especially by their superstitious mindsets and primitive beliefs but via the progressive evolution of human consciousness I would say the modern day seers have a broader spectrum of knowledge. Including an understanding of human psychology. I would say they see more of the elephant 😀 Anyway, I am just curious 🙂

Laz 15/10/21:

Do you have anyone in mind? Who would you consider the modern day seers to be?

Jane 15/10/21:

Well for me personally i would say the good channelers, like David Miller who wrote the sacred triangle books. Or the authors of the light shall set you free. A good seer to me admits that they are channeling information. They all seem to put it down to ascended master contacts.  

Laz 15/10/21:

I will research David Miller 🙂

Jane 18/10/21:

Great Bands of Emanations. So i was not sure i understood this? But here is where it took me 🙂   

"The Eagle's emanations are always grouped in clusters," he went on. "The old seers called      those clusters the great bands of emanations. They aren't really bands, but the name stuck. As you can understand, organic beings share the emanations of one band; yet seers see that  within that organic band beings are as different as they can be."      
"Are there many of these great bands?" I asked.      
"As many as infinity itself," he replied. "Seers have found out, however, that in the earth there are only forty-eight such bands."      
"What is the meaning of that, don Juan?"       
"For seers it means that there are forty-eight types of organizations on the earth, forty-eight types of clusters or structures. Organic life is one of them.  Although organic beings belong to the same great band. Think of it as an enormously wide band of luminous filaments, luminous strings with no end" 

I know I am crossing over in my mind here but the only way my mind is recognising any of this in a way I can comprehend is as the different dimensions as in different vibrational frequency ranges for the different types of life forms like elements, plants, animals, humans, etc. in the book. Basically bandwiths? 

Laz 18/10/21:

Yes, that’s as I understand it

Jane 18/10/21:

Similar to mind energy radio frequencies bandwidths in consciousness but in the physical biological world. Are the clusters or structures like the point from the band where the blueprint emerges, like a flower from a seed or a human from a zygote? From that band and emanations it creates itself to it’s full potential? Like stem cells self organise becoming organs/bone etc, programmed by DNA….   

Laz 18/10/21:

I think it is all about consciousness not physical form. I’m always reminded of this visualization of time from the Bill and Ted movies:

Jane 18/10/21:

He also said that every species has a mold of its own, and every individual of every species molded by the process shows characteristics particular to its own kind. He gave me a detailed explanation of what the mold of man was. He did not talk about it in terms of the Eagle's emanations, but in terms of a pattern of energy that serves to stamp the qualities of humanness on an amorphous blob of matter. At least, I understood it that way, especially after he further described the mold of man using a mechanical analogy. He said that it was like a gigantic die that stamps out human beings endlessly as if they were coming to it on a mass-production conveyor belt. He gave me a detailed explanation of what the mold of man was.  

So this is the mold of man as a blueprint?  

 

Laz 18/10/21:

Yes I think so.

Jane 18/10/21:

He replied that seers describe the human form as the compelling force of alignment of the emanations lit by the glow of awareness on the precise spot on which normally man's assemblage point is fixated. It is the force that makes us into persons. Thus, to be a person is to be compelled to affiliate with that force of alignment and consequently to be affiliated with the precise spot where it originates. The mold of man is exactly what its name tells us it is, a pattern, a form, a cast that groups together a particular bunch of fiberlike elements, which we call man

So can two types of frequency bands of energy, consciousness (mind, radio, waves)  and matter (body, particles) be seen as the same principles in the ‘waves or particles’ theory of light? 

In scientific findings when light passes through a slit it’s qualities are seen as being wave or particle. So are those waves and particles the equivalent of the emanations of the eagle?  Giving rise to aware consciousness? 

Laz 18/10/21:

I would say not, for me I think it is more like this; matter is computer hardware, and the consciousness is the program you run on it.

Jan 18/10/21:

Ok that makes perfect sense 🙂

Jane 18/10/21:

Think about the hologram,  From the slit or point where the light enters and projects the light through the holographic projector. Taken down to the quantum level ….Wave–particle duality is the concept in quantum mechanics that every particle or quantum entity may be described as either a particle or a wave. It expresses the inability of the classical concepts “particle” or “wave” to fully describe the behaviour of quantum-scale objects.

As Albert Einstein wrote:
[1] It seems as though we must use sometimes the one theory and sometimes the other, while at times we may use either. We are faced with a new kind of difficulty. We have two contradictory pictures of reality; separately neither of them fully explains the phenomena of light, but together they do. Through the work of Max Planck, Albert Einstein, Louis de Broglie, Arthur Compton, Niels Bohr, Erwin Schrödinger and many others, current scientific theory holds that all particles exhibit a wave nature and vice versa.
[2] This phenomenon has been verified not only for elementary particles, but also for compound particles like atoms and even molecules. For macroscopic particles, because of their extremely short wavelengths, wave properties usually cannot be detected.
[3]The hologram. Taken to that projection of the light of a hologram and its creation within the hologram, i perceive as being nothing but light waves and the vibrations that are sound waves right down to the quantum level of organisms. Only within a vacuum of space are soundwaves unable to pass through as there is no medium for them to pass through. Sound is made up of frequencies. 

Good example of this is in how sound vibrations and different frequencies make iron filings react. They make patterns like notes on a scale. I found it fascinating to watch how sound vibrations affect things in visual demonstrations on YouTube when I was contemplating them and their effects on my meatbag and hearing, that could produce pleasure to pain. Maybe it is the soundwaves that maintain the matter particles? Including for our meatbags to be alive? 

Laz 18/10/21:

I see things differently, maybe an analogy that works for me would be a virtual reality computer game where there is an avatar of you in the game and you are controlling it from your sofa with a controller and looking through its eyes. You are the consciousness in charge, but you are obviously not “in” the game with the projection of yourself. 

Jane 18/10/21:

Everything does vibrate on a quantum level and every living atom is conscious via Source/light. Or maybe the light particles are causing the sound? Whilst the particles are alive and therefore vibrating? Dunno, I know I am rambling, I was just curious, lmao. 

Laz 18/10/21:

I think logical deduction brings us to this point, yes 🙂 Consciousness is every where and like with Juan’s inorganic beings, we just operate on a different timeframe.

Jane 18/10/21:

Anyway, back on to the track… LOL.   

He said that the new seers are the only ones who have the sobriety to see the mold of man and understand what it is. What they have come to realize is that the mold of man is not a creator, but he pattern of every human attribute we can think of and some we cannot even conceive. The mold is our God because we are what it stamps us with and not because it has created us from nothing and made us in its image and likeness. Don Juan said that in his opinion to fall on our knees in the presence of the mold of man reeks of arrogance and human self-centeredness and that what we call God is a static prototype of humanness without any power.
But he went on drumming his point in a merciless way. I finally interrupted him and told him that I believe that God exsists. He retorted that my belief was based on faith and, as such, was a secondhand conviction that did not amount to anything; my belief in the existence of God was, like everyone else's, based on hearsay and not on the act of seeing, he said. He assured me that even if I was able to see, I was bound to make the same misjudgement that mystics have made. Anyone who sees the mold of man automatically assumes that it is God

This kind of reminds me what people understand as a ‘planetary god’ the one of religions. Like the way perceptions below 600 (Hawkins scale) are very different to those above. I used to believe in that planetary religious god until I reached a certain stage and realised there was something much greater out there.

Laz 18/10/21:

Yes, there is something, some entity which we can communicate with that claims this role, but it is not all there is, in my experience 🙂 Consciousness is bigger and more encompassing.

Jane 18/10/21:

That is when my focus switched extra-planetary because I had transcended the level of religion and such perceptions of god.    

He said that the old seers also came to realize that it is the high energy of organisms and the subsequent high development of their awareness that make them delectable morsels for the Eagle. In the old seers' view, gluttony was the reason the Eagle produced as many organisms as possible

Maybe they perceived it as “gluttony” or devouring in nature because it would be seen/sensed as forever expanding to a limited mind incapable of doing that manoeuvre from the old seers perspective? I see the eagle as nothing different from the awareness afforded by Source to experience itself. I have absolutely no descriptions like theirs such as “gluttony” or devouring, I think the perceptions, or rather misperceptions from the old seers is the very reason why they saw it all as so manevolent.

Maybe the gluttony they ‘saw’ was just a mirror reflection of their own greed? This perception they have of the eagle is really quite a strange one to me. I do not recognise it at all. I wonder if their type of intentional interactions with that eagle ( awareness) could be the reason why?

Laz 18/10/21:

Their ideas are very interesting, and I quite like the image of that eagle needing to feed on higher consciousness, and it seeks it out only to be thwarted by the man of knowledge who ducks and dives to avoid it.

Jane 18/10/21:

Ok so does that and gives me a different perspective of the eagle 🙂

Jane 18/10/21:

Their interactions were made with intent, as in to get something, I don’t know if they had what we would call ego’s but I would have thought that human self will still would play a part? My interactions as I said are passive but not impotent, but they are activated purely by Source will, not my will.

Laz 18/10/21:

Clearly Don Juan does by our European meaning, but I’m not sure the Yaqui see things the same way.

Jane 18/10/21:

I have never considered the concept of any kind of “reward”, for that interaction to me the very interaction is reward enough. Nor have I ever asked the Source for anything…….🙄🤔 hmm, Oh except for one thing ….a fellow alien species friend 🙂 😀   

Laz 18/10/21:

Me too 🙂 I’m not sure if that friend is me?

Jane 18/10/21:

Yes it was meant to be you and I as aliens  🙂

Jane 18/10/21:

He repeated that in the warriors' way, the shift of the assemblage point is everything. The old seers absolutely failed to realize this truth. They thought the movement of the point was like a marker that determined their positions on a scale of worth. They never conceived that it was that very position which determined what they perceived

That scale of self worth was maybe what caused misperceptions? 

Laz 18/10/21:

I think it is a base human attribute to compare ourselves to others and want to be the one everyone thinks is the best, until one learns to overcome the need.

Jane 18/10/21:

There seems to be a vast difference in the perceptions between the old seers and the new, hence…   

The old seers also opened themselves to it, but for reasons and purposes guided mostly by self-importance and obsession. The new seers, on the other hand, make friends with it. They become familiar with that force by handling it without any self-importance. The result is staggering in its consequences.    
Don Juan said next that the mastery of intent together with the mastery of stalking are the new seers' two masterpieces, which mark the arrival of the modern-day seers. He explained that in their efforts to gain an advantage over their oppressors the new seers pursued every possibility. The new seers began to practice the systematic control of their behavior. They called this practice the art of stalking. Don Juan remarked that the name, although    objectionable, was appropriate, because stalking entailed a specific kind of behavior with people, behavior that could be categorized as surreptitious

Sounds just like us and the way we would stalk people ? 😀     

"Stalking belongs exclusively to the new seers," he said, smiling. "They are the only seers who had to deal with people. The old ones were so wrapped up in their sense of power that they didn't  even know that people existed, until people started clobbering them on the head. But you already know all this."

This made me laugh, does he mean they were so far gone? 

Laz 18/10/21:

I would say so yes 🙂

Jane 18/10/21:

In my normal attention like the matrix world, people don’t exist to me unless I have to interact with them, whilst alone they are quite literally for the most part, out of sight, out of mind. But I can change attention to interact when required.    

They went one step further and maintained that impeccable men need no one to guide them, that by themselves, through saving their energy, they can do everything that seers do

Is this the same as self taught? Lone wolves? 🙂 

Laz 18/10/21:

Yes, it is the only “true” way. I would say as soon as a guru is involved the lesson is twisted to the guru’s ego. The only real thing for a teacher to do is to document their learning so a student can learn from it and push onto the next level 🙂 Maybe Shaktipat too!

Jane 18/10/21:

All that is required is impeccability, energy, and that begins with a single act that has to be deliberate, precise, and sustained. If that act is repeated long enough, one acquires a sense of unbending intent, which can be applied to    anything else. If that is accomplished the road is clear. One thing will lead to another until the warrior realizes his full potential

I can remember my only unbending intent right from the very start for me was to get rid of my ego and surrender my will. I cannot even remember why? Lol. I know that was the whole basis when I now look at my flashcard affirmations and my intent was so unbending I did not need a reason and went on to higher self brainwash myself into it 😀

I think the matrix/earths gravitational pull was draining me in mind and body and I found a different source of energy coming from my higher and spiritual realms 🙂   

The real feat is to make the assemblage point shift from its normal setting to the point of no doubt.

I get this as beyond believing into a knowing. 

Dreaming. This whole thing about dreaming to me is a bit confusing. I understand lucid dreaming as an analogy  relating to lucid living, being an awakened consciousness in life rather than asleep. If we check carefully we shall realize that our waking world exists in a way that is similar to the way in which our dream world exists. Like the dream world, our waking world appears vividly to us and seems to have its own existence independent of our mind. Just as in the dream, we believe this appearance to be true and respond with desire, anger, fear and so on.

Laz 18/10/21:

This is one of those areas of my life where I have little to no experience, I would like to find a way to consistently lucid dream so that I can make this comparison and judge if it is all the fantastic things people have written about or if it is just a “story” people tell.

I think this is really the motivation for me in the second half of my life. You know if the dream world could be as real as the daytime experience, then really our death may just be us waking up somewhere else.

Jane 18/10/21:

I never considered that but it is a fascinating thought of possibility

jane 18/10/21:

He told me then that I was in my keenest state of awareness, and that it was possible for me to intend my assemblage point to shift deeper into my left side, to a dreaming position. He said that warriors should never attempt seeing unless they are aided by dreaming. I argued that to fall asleep in public was not one of my fortes. He clarified his statement, saying that to move the assemblage point away from its natural setting and to keep it fixed at a new location is to be asleep; with practice, seers learn to be asleep and yet behave as if nothing is happening to them

Can you please explain this to me because I don’t get it? 

Laz 18/10/21:

So it must be like the lack of sleep experience we’ve both had, that dreamlike quality to everything despite being awake, and the sense that the world is not solid and can be made to change in unnatural ways 🙂

Jane 18/10/21:

The only real relevance of dreaming for me is that I can occasionally have a dream that can be analysed in order to make sense of what is going on in my life and I know that I process information in my dreams. It can occasionally seem like reviewing documents or information but I never can recall the details when I wake from sleep. Sometimes I wake to feel a really positive energy following such dreams like I have succeeded in something but I never know what or why. Lol.    

Over the years don Juan and other members of his party had tried to make me aware that we can be in two places at once, that we can experience a sort of perceptual dualism.   
"The dreaming body is known by different names," he said after a long pause. "The name I like the best is, the other.     
You saw your dreaming body watching you

Is this ‘other’ referred to, not a representation of the observer? 

Laz 18/10/21:

Isn’t this “the double”?

Jane 18/10/21:

"The nagual Julian was the last of the old-time stalkers," he went on. "He was a stalker not so much because of the circumstances of his life but because that was the bent of his character."     
Don Juan explained that the new seers saw that there are two main groups of human beings: those who care about others and those who do not. In between these two extremes they saw an endless mixture of the two. The nagual Julian belonged to the category of men who do not care; don Juan classified himself as belonging to the opposite category"

If you need impeccabilty to be a nagual how come someone who does not care about anyone have the ability to become a nagual in the first place? Or does the term impeccabilty not necessarily involve caring? Or emotions? 

Laz 18/10/21:

Yes, I would say that impeccability is for oneself and does not touch on whether one cares for others.

Jane 18/10/21:

"The old seers saw that the earth has a cocoon," he went on. "They saw that there is a ball encasing the earth, a luminous cocoon that entraps the Eagle's emanations. The earth is a gigantic sentient being subjected to the same forces we are."

So would you say this is referring to the atmospheric layer of gases around the planet that are retained by the earths gravity? Within which the earth and humans are subject to the same electromagnetic forces. 

Laz 18/10/21:

no, I think this is a consciousness layer he is referring to

Jane 18/10/21:

“I thought I was in hell! The shock of seeing the surroundings was so great that I screamed in terror, but there was no sound to my voice. Around me was the most vivid picture of  all the descriptions of hell in my Catholic upbringing. I was seeing a reddish world, hot and oppressive, dark and cavernous, with no sky, no light but the malignant reflections of reddish lights that kept on moving around us, at great speed” 

I have read about different people’s experiences in NDE’s and it is dependent on beliefs held in mind what one experiences, whether it is seen as a positive or negative thing with a Christian culture mind some will perceive “heaven” and others “hell” as described. Being of a catholic upbringing maybe this is similar to the specific experience of alignment Carlos made with his attention? 

Laz 18/10/21:

Yeah, I could see that 🙂

Jane 18/10/21:

There is always that opposite potential in human minds that is why to some the glass is half empty but to others the glass is half full. All depending on the persons alignment. Perspectives.    

He said that now I needed to have one last clarification: the coherent but irrational realization that everything in the world we have learned to perceive is inextricably tied to the position where the assemblage point is located, if the assemblage point is displaced from that position, the world will cease to be what it is to us. Don Juan stated that a displacement of the assemblage point beyond the midline of the cocoon of man makes the entire world we know vanish from our view in one instant, as if it had been erased - for the stability, the substantiality, that seems to belong to our perceivable world is just the force of alignment. Certain emanations are routinely aligned because of the fixation of the assemblage point on one specific spot; that is all there is to our world

So is this realignment of the assemblage point the same as unlearning what we have learned? Maybe this explains how it happened when my mind was deprogrammed back to factory settings?  

Laz 18/10/21:

Sort of, when you have an experience that breaks the rules you understood to be true, the old things will naturally be unlearned.

Jane 18/10/21:

"At any rate, the job of realigning all those emanations paves the way for the peculiar maneuver of lighting up all the emanations inside the cocoon. I have nearly done that. I am about to reach my maximum. Since I am the nagual, once I do light up all the emanations inside my cocoon we will all be gone in an instant."

So is he attempting to just leave? Like physically, or is he talking symbolically about an enlightening up of the emanations inside the cocoon? 

Laz 18/10/21:

This I would link back to my experience of all my neurons firing at once creating a nuclear like explosion of consciousness. 

Jane 18/10/21:

So when don Juan says he will be gone in an instant, does he mean, Literally in physical body leaving? Or as I would say with all such teachings, is that meant to be taken symbolically?

Laz 18/10/21:

I think he may disappear physically and Carlos never sees him again, if my memory serves 🙂 Whether this is him leaving, dying, or magician like “poof” into a cloud of smoke, I don’t know.

Jane 18/10/21:

This is another strange one to me, I have read how when people reach a certain level they may just leave, I guess it means they die? Is this the equivalent of those who meditate themselves to death? Lol. David Hawkins talked about it as a choice on reaching above a certain level of consciousness. As we have said we both had an experience that indicates this to be a possibility.  But if Don Juan does disappear I would love to know where he actually goes? Maybe we will find out more information on that further on? 

Laz 18/10/21:

Just consulted my beginners guide and apparently he and Genaro move on to a higher level of perception!

Laz Authors