Jane 02/08/21:
Seeing. So Don talks about “seeing” that Carlos is learning at this point in the books. He often tells him his problem is thinking too much and I understand that as being the very point where Matrix mind logic in shamanics can leave us at a big disadvantage especially by overthinking. Seeing is interpreting and comprehending a big picture exactly as it is to the point of knowing. Things like emotional input or monkey chatter also prevents seeing.
Laz 02/08/21:
Seeing is a weird thing that I’m not sure Carlos understood, it is both a precursor to Stopping the world and also a way of viewing luminous filaments that surround human bodies and perceiving energy directly as it flows through the universe.
Jane 03/08/21:
Ok I can get on board with that. Please explain stopping the world. Do you mean like a freeze frame?
Laz 03/08/21:
Stopping the world is a topic you’ll come to in the next book I think.
Laz 02/08/21:
It’s so confused in the books that it may be multiple things or nothing. I’ve personally not seen any luminous eggs, but then for whatever reason I seem to be spiritually blind, in that I don’t see visual things. I’ve often wondered if my migraines are a symptom of my spiritual sight being messed up.
Jane 03/08/21:
Will you please stop thinking that spiritual sight is visual sight phenomena or that it is messed up in you, you are not spiritually blind because you don’t see “luminous filaments that surround the body/the egg/aura” because it cannot be visually seen, I have never seen it. It is through the use of mind bending drugs and theatre that this is done by shaman its a use of imagination it is all symbolic and that means a concept understood in the subjective conscious mind not in as external vision! It is only described in that way to be conceptually visualised.
Laz 03/08/21:
Okay, I’ll stop talking about that 🙂 I can’t just ignore the subject of Clairvoyance though, I have had the other Clairs!
Jane 03/08/21:
I know about auras and chakras and human energies and that if I could see them especially in their colours they would look phenomenal. I cannot see them but I know they are there and how they are constructed. The threads of connection cords between people or objects are real but in the mental/psychological realms not an actual visual phenomena to human eyesight. Seeing is not really with the physical eyes it is a mind construct and one I know that you have :).
Jane 03/08/21:
I think I have had these too.
Clairsentience – Feeling energy. I have this all the time, I feel sound I feel other people vibrations. I feel the mood in the room. I even feel you pick up my emails. It comes straight through my belly centre.
Clairaudience – Hearing sounds. I don’t hear voices or anything but I have this mainly in the form of tinnitus types of notes/tones buzzing ringing in my ears or I hear a white noise sound as if my head is stuck out in space! 😀 I remember experiencing what is called phantom sounds at the height of my hyperaccusis crisis. That was truly a bizarre experience. I was not suggesting you stop talking about it but maybe change the expectations.
Laz 03/08/21:
The only thing that could be classed as clairvoyance that I have is when I can predict a person or event not by psychic powers but by knowing the bigger picture and patterns of behaviour. A bit like the hunter would I guess.
Jane 03/08/21:
I had proper full on clairs including clairvoyance experiences that blew my mind but it was during my 40 day testing period and I saw it as a part of the illusional trap. The siddhis. I denounced them all. To me it is simply a case of clear (or right) seeing or hearing. Eyes that truly see and ears that truly hear are not of the senses at all.
Laz 03/08/21:
I think my biggest experience was with Clairaudience at the height of my Kundalini episodes. It was proper weird to hear things that seemed real, but that no one else heard, I mean hearing a woman screaming at the top of her voice like she was being stabbed to death was unsettling to say the least!
Jane 02/08/21:
We can predict certain things by seeing. I know that you know that kind of seeing through something as in a person or situation. Getting as in understanding something symbolically is another good example of seeing, e.g. we can look superficially as a glance at something like the Rebis image or via immediate recognition it will stop our eyes in their tracks and we can see it’s entire meaning. Don gets his shaman friend, Don Genaro to show Carlos the lesson on equilibrium by getting him to act out a visual display of equilibrium via the aura energy threads. These concepts can only be seen and understood by creating and animating them out into the physical visual realm. As is the case with all subjective inner journeys and experiences. This is the archetypal realm that is contained in the 4d collective consciousness of humanity, it is where the action packed hero’s journey that goes on in the films shown about paths and myths goes on in the individual persons mind.
Looking at the magic eye pictures where your vision depth has to adjust and be specific in order to see the 3d image within the picture is a kind of analogy of what the mind has to do in order to see. Find the exact point of perception of mind. I find myself that by relaxing my eyes and not focusing on the picture works for me with those images. When I stop trying to see it, it comes into view. Going cross eyed can work too. A real clarity of seeing can be a eureka moment or revelation.
Don says that shamanics is used as a tool to seeing. Don also says that a man of knowledge who sees, no longer needs to be a sorcerer. Threads. The egg and threads Don talks about as coming from the belly sound like the aura and from the solar plexus in the chakra system. I told you that when I read about the reiki system it explained that is the spiritual vibratory centre of the hara line where I experience energy that I can feel is creating equilibrium. My centre of gravity. I cannot work out if it is the same thing though because the solar plexus is above belly button area whereas the hara spot that I feel vibrating is lower than that but yet I don’t think it is the sacral chakra?
Or maybe with it being in the subtle body makes it difficult to be able to accurately tell with the mind just exactly where sensations caused by Kundalini energy originate from?
Laz 02/08/21:
Do you mean the locations in the body, or the source of the energy somewhere outside of the body?
Jane 03/0821:
I was referring to the location of sensation within the subtle body being related to the physical body here.
Jane 02/08/21:
I am still experiencing vibrations from that lower belly centre just as I am drifting off to sleep and when I first wake up, so there is no way for me to know if the vibrations go on during my sleep or if they only occur as I am in those in between stages of sleep consciousness? It is still doing the odd contraction of my belly too? I think it’s just a balancing act?
Laz 02/08/21:
For me it always wakes me up so I’m fairly sure nothing happens to me while I’m sleeping. By the way my lucid dreaming training with my mask has taken a turn for the worse. I didn’t dream for like 2 weeks and felt negative effects of this. I stopped wearing the mask for a couple of nights and felt better, but now I’m slightly nervous of putting it on at night!
Jane 03/08/21:
Are you talking about an eye mask here? Are you saying an eye mask prevented you from dreaming? I have experienced lucid dreams but only a couple of times years ago and I must say it was a very interesting position to be in. But I’ve not been able to do it since.
Laz 03/08/21:
My apologies, I thought I had said about that. I bought this thing called a somni mask that is lucid dreaming training, with the intent on having you wake up in your dreams so you can control them. It’s not working so far however!
This is the website in case you are interested: https://somni.org/
Jane 03/08/21:
Wow! That somni mask looks really cool 🙂 The concept looks great but I don’t suppose it works on everyone. So are you aware of any of what is going on overnight? Do you hear anything? Maybe you are meant to stop dreaming as in your normal way for a while to transition to a new way of dreaming like a process. Does it mention a time frame at all? I purchased these herb things years ago that were supposed to help to lucid dream. Didn’t work 😀 But yes it is something I would love to be able to do too.
Laz 03/08/21:
My experience so far has been that the device correctly determines I’m in a REM state and starts doing it’s sounds and lights, and then I wake up, properly. It is supposed to shake me in my dream state so that I become conscious but I actually wake all the way up each time, which sucks. So I’m still trying to train myself to get used to these sounds and lights such that they don’t make me wake up for real. Last night I thought I had a bit of progress and maybe stayed in my dream for a while as the device triggered but then I got excited and woke up!
Jane 03/08/21:
Lol. You really do crack me up! But I can understand that. It does sound fascinating so keep going….If you have success I may try it out myself 🙂
I am kind of fascinated by this mask now. 😀 So did you get it from the U.S.? The price is in dollars. I can only find one retailer and it is currently out of stock. I have requested a notification when it comes back in stock, so I will leave it in the universe’s hands now…. 🙂
Laz 03/08/21:
It was originally a kickstarter campaign that I backed so that’s how I got involved. They went way over their estimated time but what I’ve received seems to be good quality. I think the company is in the US yes, although I paid in pounds through kickstarter 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
Don talks about the threads from the solar plexus that attaches us to every person we interact with, and I had many of those threads to the Matrix in the U.S. that have now been severed. Like all deleted apps and documents on my tablet and deleted energies in mind. Even Don makes reference to what seems to be “plugs”. These threads of energy between a lot of people are nothing more than the energy exchange we identified as assumptions and misperceptions. Don talks about the Gap at the solar plexus and the will?? Is that gap he refers to where if a person is wide open at that chakra but the shields of protection are not strong enough then psychological or psychic attacks can occur?
Laz 02/08/21:
Yes, that seems right.
Jane 02/08/21:
Non duality. There is a level of consciousness that can reason without emotion, I understand what the Buddha meant by having no disgust at anything. But I don’t know if that is what I term non-duality. We have determined that it is not the middle path but as I have said a transcendence out of both sides up to that level of indifference that transcends all perceptions of duality. I recently told you that I could not go any further in explaining non duality to you so what excites me the most about reading about Don Juan is that I can completely relate on seeing from Don’s perspective and I know that it does seem up to now to be implying what I am trying to express to you, so I am considering the fact that the level of seeing that Don is talking about is the same as what I term non duality? Because when don talks about his perceptions it does sound like the non duality that I tend to go on about from my perception, but yet I cannot explain it.
Laz 02/08/21:
Damn. I don’t get seeing, and i don’t understand non duality!
Jane 02/08/21:
He explains a lot of things that are unusual to the point of unacceptable to the Matrix minded person, things like having an indifference with no concerns as to outcomes due to a detachment. To the point of even an indifference to suffering. When he talks about it as an attempt to explain it as from his perception I notice that in his honesty it does come across at times as sounding harsh but I know it’s not. It is such a paradigm shift and to others can come across as a lack of caring about anything but it’s not like that, it is not an ignorant egoic indifference that doesn’t give a shit. The paradox of non duality as a perception of indifference is that it does actually come from a place of an unconditional love.
Our chakras vibrate by the ways in which we think. Which is why things like stress or “dis-ease” in thinking creates the accompanying “disease” in the physical body. Which is why holding in mind things like grudges, judgements and dishonesty is a form of self destruction. As above so below. If only people and the medical profession could grasp that! We are what/how we think. Even the Jesus teachings got that when he says “as a man thinks so he is”.
Laz 02/08/21:
I agree 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
Non duality as a perception of consciousness takes all chakras functioning/vibrating from a right thinking human mind including that of the heart. But they are all in balance so non are dominant. I think non duality also takes a multidimensional consciousness. That self contained hologram of the mind a person can attain with shamanics but as a permanent dimension without the tools of shamanics or the drugs. 🙂
I am well aware that I am an alien being on the planet and really do live in a completely different dimension to other people 😀 Sometimes all I can do is just laugh at the absurdity of my life!
Laz 02/08/21:
Well, me too. Only I have to deal with the humans in the matrix every day 😀
Jane 03/08/2!:
Yes I know and I don’t envy you there! 😀
Laz 02/08/21:
I get the impression that I already know what non duality is, I just need to find the words that express it!
Jane 03/08/21:
Me too 🙂
Laz 02/08/21:
All of my learning has been that way, in that once a concept was explained to me in a way I understood it, I found that I had always known it anyway, but had not had the words for it before.
Jane 02/08/21:
The terminology of this book title a “Separate reality” sounds very much like my term for a “different dimension”?
Laz 02/08/21:
I think it refers to the act of seeing as you say.
Jane 02/08/21:
I understand It is as basically just a very different perception of reality. I mean I get it when he says he cannot explain it to Carlos but maybe he does in more detail further down the line? we will see? 🙂 Maybe it is simply a consciousness that has escaped from The Matrix? These old shaman wouldn’t know that term or concept either, they didn’t get to see the film 🙂 I think that maybe the films Star Wars and The Matrix would probably have blown Don Juan’s mind! 😀
Laz 02/08/21:
I’m sure he would have recognised the philosophy in them 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
Will. Don says that a warrior is Waiting for his will? Does he mean self will or source will? So do typical warriors still have ego’s? What do you feel like you are waiting for when you state that you are waiting for your will?
Laz 02/08/21:
Will is something I do understand, and it is source will 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
All I can say right now is that I don’t feel like I have a will other than that as directed from source and It has been that way for so long now. Does that mean i am also once again waiting for (? my) a will?
Laz 02/08/21:
I am the same 🙂 and yes, you are waiting for the universe to align so that you may act correctly in whatever capacity it wants you to 🙂 Another example is knowing you have a wrapped birthday present to open, but you can’t open it until the day of your birthday 🙂
Jane 03/08/21:
So I understand this as divine or universal timing.
Jane 02/08/21:
When to me it is just sources next move. I found freedom in having surrendered my will 🙂
Laz 02/08/21:
yes, me too.
Jane 02/08/21:
Don constantly reminds Carlos to focus on his own death, even the will to live and the will to die seem to be at equilibrium with me now?
Laz 02/08/21:
Focusing on ones death is a reminder that we are not immortal and have only a limited time here, something that most people do not do as they won’t think about the end. Doing so affords one knowledge of the end, I’ve spent ages researching it, and also allows you to live strategically making sure things are in order, just in case. Leave nothing to chance 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
Controlled folly. So would you say that having to step down in consciousness as in bring down the mind in order to chat to people about everyday stuff, is the same as what don refers to as controlled folly?
Laz 02/08/21:
Sort of, yes. It is an exercise in behaving in “human” way that has no benefit other than for you to fit in. The difference between you and them is that you know it is frivolous and an ego driven act that brings no real knowledge about anything. Tell and laugh at the stupid jokes, agree with the illogical nonsense people speak, gossip and make shit up for giggles, like you say Chat lower realm mundane shit 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
It does kind of feel like that when I have conversations in the Matrix realms. Chat lower realm mundane shit, whereas Don says many people just obliviously live that folly. I like Don’s saying..
“treat the world as an endless mystery and what people do as an endless folly”
I can relate to Carlos’s obsession with writing everything down and being told it can prevent him from being in the experience, for fear of forgetting I used to stop, sit up, put the light on to write and lose the experience. And I would imagine that talking would definitely stop you from seeing. Their relationship is so intimately endearing and the banter between them can be so comical especially when Don is always telling Carlos that he talks too much 🙂
By being totally surrendered to the process and my path was a bit like being in a driverless car being directed by a satellite system, at times I would look to see where I was going but knowing I was not in control meant it wasn’t a good idea so I had to have absolute faith and trust in source. Try interfering with or resisting such an automated system you have no clue about and you will mess things up but I agree that as you have said during my path I have been on that innocent but I wasn’t an innocent as in being in total ignorance of my situation due to lack of knowledge or inexperience, because I had lived a full life in the desert of the real so my observer still had that overall wisdom.
Laz 02/08/21:
Yes, that may have come easier to you than it did to me, but I got there in the end 🙂 I often wonder what the point of our discussions is and what impact it may have, but then I remember the rule and just surrender to it, and I enjoy the experience knowing that it is the opposite of folly and that the universe has decreed it.
Jane 03/08/21:
I have often had these exact same thoughts too 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
But as you say this means I have not been able as yet to put terminology to all of my experiences. It is mainly a case of I now read stuff in order to determine it as others perceive it. In order to explain it.
Laz 02/08/21:
I said it above just now 🙂
Laz 02/08/21:
My mission was a very different scenario there was no place for an innocent there. It took full on 360 professional awareness and responsibility. I had occasions on my mission where I felt I was maybe in too deep but again I had to give it all up to source because I had no choice. Now I am back out of the Matrix again I am fortunate enough to be able to live outside of time as in past/future and In the now again, I don’t make plans with no concern for yesterday or tomorrow. I had taken on huge responsibility as an advocate on my mission, a feeling of being dragged back into the Matrix and as such, tick tock time trapped, plugged in, but I seem to be free of all of that again.
Laz 02/08/21:
I’ve never really gotten out so I can only imagine what that is like. I’ve always felt my path is that of a Bodhisattva, so I ain’t getting out 🙂
Jane 02/0821:
It’s so ironic to me that my life was being perceived as me doing nothing and my taking on no responsibility! When in my own reality/world that included the Matrix realm through the portal of a tablet, I have been working my arse off! I didn’t even have chance or time to read at my leisure. That is why it has felt to me just like I was living some sort of crazy secretive double life that I have now unplugged from.
You said you studied things like Hinduism and Buddhism so did Don Jaun’s teachings have more impact to you than these other teachings?
Laz 02/08/21:
Yes, as it is complementary to those others, and helped explain some of the concepts that Hinduism for example talks about in 1000’s of years old language. Why I wanted to write Drew Juna was to update that language again for another generation 🙂
Jane 03/02/08:
That’s interesting.
Jane 02/08/21:
Is Don teaching the 8 fold path way of right living?
Laz 02/08/21:
No, he’s to cantankerous for that, and as an old ego lead prankster it is not his path. There’s cross over for sure, but I can’t imagine Juan being anything less than nasty towards La Gorda!
Jane 03/08/21:
This made me laugh 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
As I have said I have not been drawn to do any shamanic stuff for a while now and weed doesn’t expand my consciousness anymore but instead it tends to make me more focused with my reading, writing and processing, i.e. my minds workings. 🙂 So was that thing they did with the witch the one you mentioned? Was it just a trick? Test of loyalty? Initiation? I could not tell if it is concluded or does it have a future role in the story?
Laz 02/08/21:
Yes it was a test and the witch returns later, and is revealed as the name above 🙂
Jane 02/08/21:
Don Juan is turning out to be an excellent teacher and such a character, he is so funny and he specifically cracked me up with his comments about the Tibetan book of the dead 😀 He certainly makes you laugh out loud 🙂